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TS Random (Team Slayer Discussion)

Tue Jul 27, 2010 1:58 pm

Team slayer, its a playlist i really don't want to get skill locked on like so many others but, i don't get many chances to go in with a party. so if i choose to go in as a random do i still have a good chance on winning or am i doomed to fail against parties?
(i have gone in before as a random, did somewhat well, was able to party up and made some new friends, but...)
::help::

P.S. if this gets some good comments it may be helpful to others which is why i posted it here.
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Re: TS Random

Tue Jul 27, 2010 3:12 pm

Okay, I will try and include as much of my knowledge of Team Slayer into this thread as I can. But before I get into depth about Map strats and tips etc, some basics need to be established.

-Veto ARs. Everytime. No matter if it is on your faviorite map, veto it. Simply because with this simple action you can allow yourself to re-establish control even if you lose the opening rush or are getting spawn trapped.

-Prefer Good Connection. Not a must, but I would recommend it. This is XbL, and you want to remove as many random variables as you can, bad connections being one of them. Losing a game because of a foriegn host is as annoying as anything.

-Weapon Skill. To be good at Team Slayer, you need to have a BR that you can trust. There will be clutch situations where your individual BR can either maintain map control and allow another opportunity at spawn trapping the opposition, or contain your team into an unfavourable part of the map. BR vampirism, Octogan and other 'training' customs are good ways to acquire better weapon skill. If you want to read further into warming-up and training your weapon skill, click this.

-Patience. Team Slayer is not a fast paced playlist, and you need to readily accept that at times, you will have to sit back. On occasions, even though you are losing, you will have to wait for the next set of Power-Items to spawn. Train yourself to be patient.

-Callouts. An integral part of any Team Playlist. Know these like the back of your hand. If you are unsure of some, go into a custom game with a knowledgable friend and go over the parts of the map until you have them memorised and can call it out by instinct.

-Spawn Trapping. On all maps, there are postions you want to put your opponents in that will favour yourself, for example Green on Guardian, Courtyard on Pit etc etc. You need to know the spawns very well to predict enemy movement and possible pushes. KNOW THE SPAWNS.

And without further ado...

Guardian

Spoiler: show
A terrible map in my opinion. Everything that is bad about Team Slayer, is present in this singular map. But seeing how it has a ridiculously high percentage in the playlist (at least it seems like that), I guess there is no avoiding it.

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Okay. First off, Opening Push. Something that is annoyingly important on this map.

Elbow Spawn
You instantly have the advantage. You want to have someone contest for the Invis. A good way for this player to turn the battle in their favour is to pick up the Brute Shot and spam some shots into the doorway followed by a prenade. If this is successful, the Camo Guy should back off and try and make his way over to top blue to put pressure on the opposition from the bat.

One player should remain on Elbow to spam nades at Blue Window and watch Snipe Lift and put shots on players trying to make a quick S3 push. If you are this player, put as many shots into them as you can.

The remaining players should go up to S2. One getting the Snipe and the other 'baiting' Overshield. In other words, waiting for someone to challenge and getting that 5 second invincibility boost for an easy kill.

Bottom Blue Spawn
Always a sinking feeling when you spawn here. Again, contest for that invis, send one guy to go for it. If successful the Camo guy can go Top Mid and jump S3 to harass the opposition into picking up the OV early.

Another player should sit on Ghey Jump and put as many shots into the person jumping from Green Lift. Basically doing the same job as the guy watching Snipe Lift. This is a very important job so have your best shot man hold this down.

The remaining players have a choice. They can either leave the Shotty for their teammate watching green lift, or one can get it, and instantly push Bottom Mid and go to Green. People will generally not expect this and it is a good way to attain Sniper control from the beginning.

A final option is to go to Top Blue, spam some nades at S2/Elbow and simply watch for any foolish rushers top mid. This is the safest option to go for, but only one guy should. And you always want a guy to do this in case the other team make a surprise push through Top Blue.

Well that is the Opening Rush for Guardian. Sorry it was so long, but it really is pivotal in setting the pace of the game and how it will be played. This section for other maps will be no way near as long.

Basic Set-ups

Sniper-Tower/Green.

The strongest set-up you can have in Team Slayer. To make it even better, you want to have a quality sniper. The conformist set-up is to situate this sniper S2. However, I find that positioning yourself with the Snipe at Top Green is the best. The enemy do not suspect it, and you are locking down the easiest way to Break your control - Rushing through Blue WIndow/Snipe Lift. The remaining players should be positioned around S2 where they can easily channel their view to Bottom Mid or Blue WIndow/Lift.

With 4 players, it is not a bad idea to have a guy on Camo, if this player also has a grav hammer/Shotgun, they are a huge pain in the enemies side, preventing fire to the sniper, watching top Mid, monitering top Gold and being an extra gun for battle at Top Blue.

Blue/Gold.

I actually prefer this set-up if I have the lead, because the enemy have to come to you in a confined place. You want to have a guy top blue, occasionally going out to Blue Window. Another Player at Gold. And another at Blue Hall. If it is 4v4, have your final guy on ghey jump to watch Green and sneaky players coming through bottom mid.

Breaking Set-Ups

This is huge in Team Slayer and is generally what you will be doing most of the time.

Breaking Sniper Tower/Green Setup.

For this, you want to catch the opposition off guard so one player can make a quick lift to S3 and spam some nades down to S2/S1. Another player should push camo and try and weaken players at green so a team-mate can push through Bottom mid and pick up some kills. From this, you want the guy at camo to push top mid all the while nade spamming S2, the guy at green to push up elbow, who should also be nade spamming if possible. The guy at S3 should try and clean up kills. If you have a fourth, a good tip is to have him support the guy camo by being top gold and firing into S2 before dropping to bottom mid to support at Green or push S1. With this, you will have the enemy team spawning bottom blue, an easy position to spawn trap them in with some pre-nades and team-fire.

Breaking Blue/Gold Setup

Assuming the game is a stalement, but you need kills and have Snipe control. Have your guy at Green, lift to invis (if no-ones already there from your team) and send another guy to green. Situate your sniper at S2 and have your remaining player Push Blue window. From then on, you want to establish Top Gold/Blue Control with numbers through the player at green jumping Top mid to support the camo/Blue Window Player. This will spawn the enemy at Green or elbow, the easiest place to spawn trap them in as long as your final player at S2 remains calm with people charging up elbow. Nades are your friends if you are that player.

And...that's guardian in a nutshell. I know you said you go in as a random, I know what it is like, personally getting my 50 in TS as a random. I highly urge you to either play in a team 3s/4s or play in 2s. And utilize greater communication to organize some of these simple (yet successful) strategies.


Boundless

Spoiler: show
The bane of my existence whenever I play Team Slayer. Again, this map seems to come up a lot so I will try and get this out of the way. There are many varying strats that can be employed on this map, and the one I like to utilize is not generally accepted. I'm sure others will provide their own views.

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Another asymmetrical map, so I guess I will do another set of in-depth opening pushes for this map.

Low Base/Open Base Spawn

Some people prefer this spawn because it gives easier and more re-inforced access to the shotgun with the advantage of the Cave Overshield. A good strat is to send 1 guy to get the Overshield and another guy to support him. These two players can rain shots down on top mid and possibly cause the enemy teams OV to be burned in the process and leave some players weak for easy pickings for the sniper. The best sniper should ofcourse pick up the sniper from the bottom base, and make his way to the Right hand side of the base (near the OV Cave). This gives plenty of cover and an easy escape route if multiple enemies charge your opening spawn. If you have a fourth, situate this player on the opposite side of the base (near Rocks) to cover the front of the base and help teamshot players top mid with the players at Shotgun.

High Base/Closed Base Spawn

My personal preferred spawn. Have two guys go to the Rocks Overshield and navigate through Rocks. Make sure to check over to shotgun and try to put as many shots in the OS guy as you can. These two players should be agressive and have the strongest BRs on the team as they should instantly be pushing the enemy spawn to trap them at shotgun. The Sniper on the Team should make his way to the right hand side of his base to support the two Rushers. The final player (if there is one), should go over to batteries to cover the front of the base and help team-shot players at shotgun and support players rushing the enemy sniper.

No-one from this base should go to shotgun.

Basic Setups

Just a note here, I will not be going over set-ups designed to be passive. All of the following are aggresive positions to push the enemy team into a spawn trap. There are passive set-ups, and others can go over them. I however, dislike using them.

Pushing from Closed Base

This is the strongest strat you can have in my eyes. There are two ways to push from this base depending on the enemy location. Pushing through batteries to trap at shotgun. Or pushing through rocks to trap at back open.

Pushing through Batteries to Shotgun - Quite an aggressive strat but good if you want to break away into a lead. If you have a sniper, situate him on the top of Closed Base. If not, have a guy be on the top of the base any way. This player can oversee the opponents base, call out if they are going through rocks (in which case you don't want to do this strat) and put shots on players on their base and their Cave OV to protect his teammates. Two of these teammates should push shotgun through batteries (make sure the enemy does not have OV). The final teammate should delay his push, sitting in front of Closed base protecting the sniper until the two shotgun rushers call out weak players. At this point, this player should go top mid and drop to shotgun cave and do some easy clean-up work.

From this, the enemy will generally spawn back Open. An easy spawn trap.

Pushing through Rocks - This is a much safer and more conservative push. Again, you have you one player on top of the base with another protecting a bit before mongoose. Two players should be aggressive and go through rocks. I like it if one of these players has a sniper, to watch for any sneaky flank from Shotgun or Closed Batteries. Again the player at mongoose should delay his push until callouts of weak players are made, at which point this player should push to the top (or bottom depending on the callouts) of open base to get some easy clean-ups. The player on closed base should be team-firing people trying to run through Cave OV and spawners.

These spawners will generally be at Shotgun where you can easily trap them once again, or leave them to go bottom mid where they can do nothing, except get trapped in one of the bases.

Pushing from Open Base

I see a lot of people like to push through Cave OS. I will tell you now, do not do this at any time except for the Opening Rush. Period. If you are at this base, what you want to do is situate yourself and your team on the opposing base so you can use one of the strats above.

Pushing through Rocks - An almost identical play to the push through rocks from Closed Base except the player on top of Open base should be looing at Closed Batteries and watching spawners at Shotgun (or behind him).

For all these pushes, you need to make sure that the OV is not going to come up for a while. The time for the OV is 3 minutes spawn timer started the moment you pick it up. Remeber this for all maps. The same goes for Invis.

Getting out of a Spawn Trap

Always one of the hardest things to do on any map in any playlist. However, if you can re-establish control you will find yourself with 6-7 more kills with no deaths on your teams part.

Spawn Trapped at Shotgun

Despite how tempting it seems, try to avoid going to bottom middle, unless you are the player who is going to be pushing top mid. All other players should push Closed Batteries and make their way to Closed base to gain map control. Watch out for spawner at Back Open that can fire shots down at you. To combat this, one player should stick slightly in front of shotgun in order to put shots on these players and make them back down. Similiarly the guy going top Mid should check behind him before pushing the bottom of Closed Base.

Spawn Trapped at Back Open

Do not go fleeing behind the Back Open Batteries. Push the top of Open base and attempt to control it. Other players should push rocks in order to prepare for spawners at Closed Base if there are any. The players on top of Open should be wary of shots coming from Closed Batteries/ Shotgun and spawners at Cave OS. Try and get away from Open base as quickly as you can. Rocks has the most cover and sightlines of the entire map.

These tips for Boundless all require a lot of team-work, and communication. You don't have to go exactly by what I said, as circumstances may prevent these exact strats. You have to learn to improvise and be unexpected. But I think these tips are a good skeleton to go by.


I'll do another map in a few hours.

Spoiler tags added to shrink the post down a bit. ~Sarge
Last edited by Sarge on Wed Jul 28, 2010 8:45 am, edited 5 times in total.
Reason: Added spoiler tags to shrink the post.
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Re: TS Random

Tue Jul 27, 2010 4:03 pm

Just an fyi, if you go in as a random, you will not face parties.

You will face other randoms, with MAYBE a party of 2 on both teams/One team.

You cannot get a party of 4 vs randoms, in ranked.
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Re: TS Random

Tue Jul 27, 2010 4:06 pm

However, you can be a random in a party of 3 v 3, and become their 4th.
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Yozi
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Re: TS Random

Tue Jul 27, 2010 10:38 pm

Hippo picks up the EPIC POST achievement. *cue bleep-bloop*

Very nice, Geeb!

HipHopHippo wrote:
Blue Window

I realized/remembered this after playing and using this callout frequently the other day; it is better named Blue Glass. To many players, Blue Window is the ledge you jump from in blue room to top gold.

HipHopHippo wrote:
Basic Set-ups
Sniper-Tower/Green.

[...]

With 4 players, it is not a bad idea to have a guy on Camo, if this player also has a grav hammer/Shotgun, they are a huge pain in the enemies side, preventing fire to the sniper, watching top Mid, monitering top Gold and being an extra gun for battle at Top Blue.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but in some cases, and if you're really unlucky, I'm pretty sure this could cause the enemy to spawn green, elbow or s2 (that is, on your side of the map). So keep in mind that you don't want to leave gaps in blocking those spawns open for too long (particularly the elbow spawn if you have two peeps at s2, one at camo and one at top green) if you wanna keep the setup going strong.

And here's a tip that may seem stupidly obvious but that is important and sometimes overlooked: it's to always try and talk to your random teammates in the pre-game lobby.. just say something to let them know you're there and willing to communicate. Then if they respond you can go from there with talk of opening strats and so on.
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Re: TS Random

Tue Jul 27, 2010 11:24 pm

Yozi has a few good points here ,one of which is about blue window. Even though I personally refer to blue glass as blue window I think it makes sense calling that as blue glass and the other opening the blue window/gap. However that's trivial. Forcing the other team to spawn Green/Blue is something I try and do alot of the time, if you're S3 and some of the other team die I tend to move to S2 to block elbow spawn. Small things like that to manipulate spawns.

Also one of the things I do and I've noticed gibran does alot is talk to our random teammates. Like "Hey _____ How's it going" which is so much better than saying "How come we get the worst randoms?".

Awesome post Hippo! ::thumbs::
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Re: TS Random

Wed Jul 28, 2010 5:32 am

HipHopHippo wrote:

Bottom Blue Spawn
Always a sinking feeling when you spawn here. Again, contest for that invis, send one guy to go for it. If successful the Camo guy can go Top Mid and jump S3 to harass the opposition into picking up the OV early.



If you're in a "1v1" at camo the guy from elbow spawn almost always manages to prevail, so what I always do with bottom blue spawn is start crouching at top gold. The dude thinks there is no one there, so picks up the camo... here you surprise him with a quick nade+headshot. You don't get the camo this way but it's an effective way of winning the "1v1" and burning the camo
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Re: TS Random

Wed Jul 28, 2010 7:45 am

Thanks guys, I just updated my post with some Boundless tips.
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Re: TS Random

Wed Jul 28, 2010 8:44 am

I very much approve of the way you present your strategies. I'll admit to usually being a passive player, but I like how you've shown how to play the maps aggressively.
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Re: TS Random

Fri Jul 30, 2010 3:20 pm

likelikelike. I've been going in as a random and got up to 46 but went back down to 45 because of bad randoms/really good opponents sooo if anyone wants to play TS avec moi I'll be psyched.

This is a thread to discuss tactics for Team Slayer. Please stay on topic. ~Sarge
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